Yep, you should only believe a government bureaucrat 'cause they're so competent, pure of heart and without bias. I'll bet old "Anonymous" (strange name) is sitting in his own home triple masked right now.
Even so, the video is accurate. The branch of mechanical engineering that studies lubrication is tribology. With respect to the lubricating properties of the motor oil, the viscosity of the oil is of paramount importance and is tailored to the clearance between the crankshaft and the bearings. Same thing for rod bearings. The idea is to have no metal to metal contact, where the crankshaft is “floating” on a film of oil a few ten thousandths of an inch thick when it is rotating. Synthetic oils tend to be more stable in viscosity over use than Dino oils. The bottom line is that with a good oil filter you can go more miles between oil changes.
As for seal compatibility, it used to be a problem in the early days of synthetic oils. The additive packages were not entirely compatible. The auto manufacturers addressed this and the seals now are compatible with all commercially available oils.
Finally, if you have a gunked up engine, it may not be a good idea to use a high detergent synthetic oil, or a high detergent Dino oil for that matter. This can dislodge years of gunk and instantly foul up the filter and in extreme cases clog the screen on the oil intake.
For epochs I ran Chevron Delo oils. In the beginning I ran 30wt, then eventually switched to 15-40. Way back in the 60s it was common belief that if you switched to Delo you might have a problem with accumulated deposits being flushed by high detergent Delo. But if you ran it from the beginning, you couldn't beat it. And I believe that's true. I had a Cummins 350 in a Kenworth that every 150-200K miles I'd check and replace the rods and mains. I began to wonder why I should bother, as every time I'd check they looked just like new. Even when I overhauled that motor, at about 830,000 miles, everything looked like it could go another 830,000 miles. Unfortunately, the truck burned up in a wildfire so I never was able to find out if I could go a million and a half miles on that motor or not. I'll bet I could have.
Royal Purple synthetic has some heavy duty cleaning components that can lead to oil pump screen clogging. I know a mechanic that learned this the hard way. The engine wasn't damaged, but the oil pressure dropped to zero, and would have eventually frozen.
As far as other synthetics, I have no idea if they can harm an old engine, but would recommend "weaning" the engine. Don't replace all the oil with a synthetic, and eventually have full synthetic over a few oil changes.
Well...I did use it in a six cylinder Chevy truck I'd had. Used 20W-40 synthetic and since we have emission testing here ( truck was a 1976 , so too new to be exempt )it avoided some of the hydrocarbon emissions from the crackcase evacuation system raising the tailpipe levels. Oil pressure was fine- but I would not run some of the super light bodied stuff in a engine whose bearing clearances are NOT super tight and built to be that way. This was an old school production engine and had clearances typical of that breed in that day. When new, I think 10W-30 would have been fine, but not this 0W or 5W - 20 or some such.
It's good if you started using it when the engine is new. I have a car (now driven by my Grandson) that I started on synthetic blend at the 500 mile oil change. It now has 170,000 miles on it and it's still going strong. I wouldn't switch one without some careful planning.
This is what I did with my Toyota 1st Gen ‘03. Good motor, sucky MPG. Thing ran fine for 196k when I sold it and got the “same” truck with a 2017 vintage. Nothing wrong with the drive train - misc BS with electrical stuff and trim expected on a 15 yr old vehicle. My ‘17 gets a new filter and 5-20 Mobile 1 every 10,000 miles. I expect it to last as long as my other truck.
I have an 86 Ford 300 that I built and after the rings seated (about 8000 miles) I started running Amsoil synthetic with their filter. I change oil once a year, about 20-25,000 miles. The engine has 150,000 miles on it and running strong.
VW TDI engines, especially the ALH model from 1999 thru 2003 require Synthetic oil in order to keep the intake manifold from gunking up One of mine, a 2003 Jetta, has 380,000 miles and still going strong using Mobil 0W-30 full synthetic and 10W-30 synthetic before that became available. That is with a 3000-mile oil change interval.
I have seen a 120k SBC 350 on lifetime Quaker State that had no oil leaks start weeping oil at almost every seal with Mobil 1 after 100 miles. It is an 82 GMC Sierra power nothing, w/ AC, w/ first year of auto-overdrive P/U. I opened it up and it was full of sludge mud. The detergent in the synthetic oil turned all of the built up varnish inside the engine into sludge. The hardened varnish was plugging cracked and broken gaskets. After new rings, head job, oil pump, and all new gaskets with a fresh cam and new solid tappets it went together with no issues. All of the computer crap and emissions were removed and a Holly 600 was put on top with an HEI distributor. I ran Mobil 1 and changed it and the filter at 100 miles and again at 500 and 1000. Each time cutting open the oil can looking for metal. The rear end died not long after and it got a 2:73 open rear (that was free). I put 90K on it and parked it as I got deployed and it had a dead battery when I got back. It sat for 7 years. New battery, gas and brake job got it going again. It has just over 200K since minor rebuild with Mobil 1. My niece's husband has been using it for a commuter for the past 7 years as it gets 22 mpg and the radio and AC still work. He has been slowly restoring it and wants to put a posi 3:42 or 3:73 under the rear. He has restored almost everything but the paint. It has trouble pulling a load or carrying any kind of weight but it get good gas mileage and has been dependable.
Ran full synthetic in a used engine that I put in my old pickup. Bad move. It cleaned it out too well and the consumption went way up, even though it was the same viscosity. I went back to conventional and the consumption went back down a good bit after a couple of changes.
I run only full synthetic in my car and it is fine. I only ran full synthetic in the original pickup engine once I drained the factory oil. It did fantastic until it was killed by a water pump that failed on the way to work.
I have a 2001 Ford Expedition 5.4l that I have been using partial and full synthetic on for the last 10 years. I have 302k miles on it and just did an oil change on it today. I change the oil every 10k and she is still running strong.
From experience with at least 6 old engines never run on synthetic. Yes they will develop leaks, sometimes severe when switched to synthetic. In 3 cases switching back to Dino oil reduced or stopped the leaks after 4-5 oil changes.
Bearing clearances on 40s through 70s engines were not designed for multiviscosity oils which was not thoroughly covered in the video. They will cause more bearing wear when heated to operating temps. Use straight 30 weight with lots of zinc.
I work at a John Deere dealer and recently had a track loader in the shop that had almost 5000 hours on it. The owner has used Amsoil synthetic since the breakin oil change. We had to pull the engine for low compression finding the turbo inlet tube had cracked allowing dirt to dust the top of the engine. The amazing part was when I pulled the main caps, there was no wear on the bearing and the oil left the engine really clean to the point cleaning solvent washed every part clean without scrubbing. I have seen the same engine run in other machines with less hours show more wear and staining using dino oil. Just my two cents.
I ran a snowmobile grooming operation up here in North Maine using Ford and New Holland tractors with track conversions. We found that after changing to full synthetic, the engines would start a lot easier in very cold weather.
I believe once you've gotten past break in an engines with do much better with synthetic over Dino but, an engine with lots of miles or running time should be refreshed, rebuilt, before switching. JD
I bought a Dodge truck way back in the day it was fairly new around 50 k miles I ran synthetic oil in her (Mobile 1) and changed it every 5 thousand miles . when the water pump died at 134k i figured if i was that far into it might as well do the timing chain too . That stuff looked really good when I tore it apart. and I ran that thing for eighteen years mostly every day. I finally gave up on it because of rust, and electrical trouble the old 360 cid powerplant still ran like a champ with over 223,000 miles .
I was down at Walmart awhile back looking for regular dino oil and the closest they had was blended syn/pet oil in the weight I needed.
ReplyDeleteMobil sponsored the video, you already know the conclusion without watching
ReplyDeleteYep, you should only believe a government bureaucrat 'cause they're so competent, pure of heart and without bias. I'll bet old "Anonymous" (strange name) is sitting in his own home triple masked right now.
DeleteEven so, the video is accurate. The branch of mechanical engineering that studies lubrication is tribology. With respect to the lubricating properties of the motor oil, the viscosity of the oil is of paramount importance and is tailored to the clearance between the crankshaft and the bearings. Same thing for rod bearings. The idea is to have no metal to metal contact, where the crankshaft is “floating” on a film of oil a few ten thousandths of an inch thick when it is rotating. Synthetic oils tend to be more stable in viscosity over use than Dino oils. The bottom line is that with a good oil filter you can go more miles between oil changes.
DeleteAs for seal compatibility, it used to be a problem in the early days of synthetic oils. The additive packages were not entirely compatible. The auto manufacturers addressed this and the seals now are compatible with all commercially available oils.
Finally, if you have a gunked up engine, it may not be a good idea to use a high detergent synthetic oil, or a high detergent Dino oil for that matter. This can dislodge years of gunk and instantly foul up the filter and in extreme cases clog the screen on the oil intake.
For epochs I ran Chevron Delo oils. In the beginning I ran 30wt, then eventually switched to 15-40. Way back in the 60s it was common belief that if you switched to Delo you might have a problem with accumulated deposits being flushed by high detergent Delo. But if you ran it from the beginning, you couldn't beat it. And I believe that's true. I had a Cummins 350 in a Kenworth that every 150-200K miles I'd check and replace the rods and mains. I began to wonder why I should bother, as every time I'd check they looked just like new.
DeleteEven when I overhauled that motor, at about 830,000 miles, everything looked like it could go another 830,000 miles.
Unfortunately, the truck burned up in a wildfire so I never was able to find out if I could go a million and a half miles on that motor or not. I'll bet I could have.
Royal Purple synthetic has some heavy duty cleaning components that can lead to oil pump screen clogging. I know a mechanic that learned this the hard way. The engine wasn't damaged, but the oil pressure dropped to zero, and would have eventually frozen.
ReplyDeleteAs far as other synthetics, I have no idea if they can harm an old engine, but would recommend "weaning" the engine. Don't replace all the oil with a synthetic, and eventually have full synthetic over a few oil changes.
I wouldn't use it in an old well worn motor
ReplyDeleteJD
Well...I did use it in a six cylinder Chevy truck I'd had. Used 20W-40 synthetic and since we have emission testing here ( truck was a 1976 , so too new to be exempt )it avoided some of the hydrocarbon emissions from the crackcase evacuation system raising the tailpipe levels. Oil pressure was fine- but I would not run some of the super light bodied stuff in a engine whose bearing clearances are NOT super tight and built to be that way. This was an old school production engine and had clearances typical of that breed in that day. When new, I think 10W-30 would have been fine, but not this 0W or 5W - 20 or some such.
ReplyDeleteIt's good if you started using it when the engine is new. I have a car (now driven by my Grandson) that I started on synthetic blend at the 500 mile oil change. It now has 170,000 miles on it and it's still going strong. I wouldn't switch one without some careful planning.
ReplyDeleteThis is what I did with my Toyota 1st Gen ‘03.
DeleteGood motor, sucky MPG. Thing ran fine for 196k when I sold it and got the “same” truck with a 2017 vintage.
Nothing wrong with the drive train - misc BS with electrical stuff and trim expected on a 15 yr old vehicle.
My ‘17 gets a new filter and 5-20 Mobile 1 every 10,000 miles. I expect it to last as long as my other truck.
I have an 86 Ford 300 that I built and after the rings seated (about 8000 miles) I started running Amsoil synthetic with their filter. I change oil once a year, about 20-25,000 miles. The engine has 150,000 miles on it and running strong.
ReplyDeleteVW TDI engines, especially the ALH model from 1999 thru 2003 require Synthetic oil in order to keep the intake manifold from gunking up
ReplyDeleteOne of mine, a 2003 Jetta, has 380,000 miles and still going strong using Mobil 0W-30 full synthetic and 10W-30 synthetic before that became available.
That is with a 3000-mile oil change interval.
I have seen a 120k SBC 350 on lifetime Quaker State that had no oil leaks start weeping oil at almost every seal with Mobil 1 after 100 miles. It is an 82 GMC Sierra power nothing, w/ AC, w/ first year of auto-overdrive P/U. I opened it up and it was full of sludge mud. The detergent in the synthetic oil turned all of the built up varnish inside the engine into sludge. The hardened varnish was plugging cracked and broken gaskets. After new rings, head job, oil pump, and all new gaskets with a fresh cam and new solid tappets it went together with no issues. All of the computer crap and emissions were removed and a Holly 600 was put on top with an HEI distributor. I ran Mobil 1 and changed it and the filter at 100 miles and again at 500 and 1000. Each time cutting open the oil can looking for metal. The rear end died not long after and it got a 2:73 open rear (that was free). I put 90K on it and parked it as I got deployed and it had a dead battery when I got back. It sat for 7 years. New battery, gas and brake job got it going again. It has just over 200K since minor rebuild with Mobil 1. My niece's husband has been using it for a commuter for the past 7 years as it gets 22 mpg and the radio and AC still work. He has been slowly restoring it and wants to put a posi 3:42 or 3:73 under the rear. He has restored almost everything but the paint. It has trouble pulling a load or carrying any kind of weight but it get good gas mileage and has been dependable.
ReplyDeleteRan full synthetic in a used engine that I put in my old pickup. Bad move. It cleaned it out too well and the consumption went way up, even though it was the same viscosity. I went back to conventional and the consumption went back down a good bit after a couple of changes.
ReplyDeleteI run only full synthetic in my car and it is fine. I only ran full synthetic in the original pickup engine once I drained the factory oil. It did fantastic until it was killed by a water pump that failed on the way to work.
I have a 2001 Ford Expedition 5.4l that I have been using partial and full synthetic on for the last 10 years. I have 302k miles on it and just did an oil change on it today. I change the oil every 10k and she is still running strong.
ReplyDeleteFrom experience with at least 6 old engines never run on synthetic. Yes they will develop leaks, sometimes severe when switched to synthetic. In 3 cases switching back to Dino oil reduced or stopped the leaks after 4-5 oil changes.
ReplyDeleteBearing clearances on 40s through 70s engines were not designed for multiviscosity oils which was not thoroughly covered in the video. They will cause more bearing wear when heated to operating temps. Use straight 30 weight with lots of zinc.
I work at a John Deere dealer and recently had a track loader in the shop that had almost 5000 hours on it. The owner has used Amsoil synthetic since the breakin oil change. We had to pull the engine for low compression finding the turbo inlet tube had cracked allowing dirt to dust the top of the engine. The amazing part was when I pulled the main caps, there was no wear on the bearing and the oil left the engine really clean to the point cleaning solvent washed every part clean without scrubbing. I have seen the same engine run in other machines with less hours show more wear and staining using dino oil. Just my two cents.
ReplyDeleteI ran a snowmobile grooming operation up here in North Maine using Ford and New Holland tractors with track conversions.
DeleteWe found that after changing to full synthetic, the engines would start a lot easier in very cold weather.
I find that generators start a lot easier in cold weather with synthetic.
DeleteI believe once you've gotten past break in an engines with do much better with synthetic over Dino but, an engine with lots of miles or running time should be refreshed, rebuilt, before switching.
DeleteJD
I consider synthetic oil essential for turbocharged engines.
ReplyDeleteFor what it's worth, guys, having to use conventional oil to break an engine in is also a myth. So is taking thousands of miles to break an engine in.
ReplyDeleteEngine break-in takes about 20 minutes, and can definitely be done with synthetic oil.
I like to give a new engine about 500 miles, about equivalent to a days ride, to settle in before romping it or going to synthetic oil.
DeleteJD
I bought a Dodge truck way back in the day it was fairly new around 50 k miles I ran synthetic oil in her (Mobile 1) and changed it every 5 thousand miles . when the water pump died at 134k i figured if i was that far into it might as well do the timing chain too . That stuff looked really good when I tore it apart. and I ran that thing for eighteen years mostly every day. I finally gave up on it because of rust, and electrical trouble the old 360 cid powerplant still ran like a champ with over 223,000 miles .
ReplyDelete